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Familiar Face |
“ I agree, Book. I'm at a bad point in my life concerning God & religion. (is it real?) Not a good place to be. What's scary is with all the questions I have, dying & going where I didn't want to go which was the place I thought possibly didn't exist.”
That statement by semiannualchick says it all. She did not want to have doubts. She didn’t plan for her faith to waver. And neither did the rest of us who have been in her very same place at that ‘crossroads’ place in our lives. But there it is. It’s one of those signposts, out in a desert. · One arrow points to a comfortable place where we have spent most of our lives. A simpler time when childhood memories still reside. Santa Claus and The Easter Bunny are there. We were taught by our parents and grandparents that God loves us and has a plan. And all we had to do was believe, say our prayers, and we would someday all be together forever in the sky in a beautiful city of gold. · The other arrow points us to a place where we have never been. We were taught that to even consider the thought of this place was evil. This place is a world without Jehovah God. Yet we are inextricably drawn toward this dark and thorny path. Semiannualchick, you are going to be OK. You are not going to hell, and the world around you is not going to collapse. You see there is something else to believe in. There is something else to give you peace. I would like us, all who do not ascribe to the strict fundamental tenets of the Christian Bible, to consider a question. “If we exist in the first place, is it not logical to believe that the life force in all of us is made of something greater than this physical world, and could it not continue on after we cast off these physical bonds?” I, for one, strongly believe this. And I am comforted by the inherent logic found in this mental discipline. I have intended for this discussion thread to be added-to by those of us who are struggling with the issue of a new faith paradigm. All are welcome to comment, however, I think it would be nice if those who wish to preach would refrain. This discussion is intended for those who have already chosen their new pathway, and want to have some light shed on it. OK, that is the beginning. I certainly have a lot to say on this subject, but I have said enough for the moment. Could some of you come in now to ask some questions; offer some insight; or expand on my premise? Max "Truth is a target that moves in uncertain pathways." Get some help, Bill. Seriously. |
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Hall of Famer |
Belief, or lack of belief, does nothing to change reality.
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Small Talker |
Many of us have come to that fork in the road, but the path away from religion is not dark nor thorny. It's liberating and clean.
I came to full grips with atheism when I was 18, and dinosaurs roamed the Earth. I had been fuzzy on the issue for a few years before. There are those of us so made that we cannot believe. We must see evidence. We won't just take someone's word on miracles and metaphysics. We understand peer pressure and the pack-animal tendency to conform to social norms, and understanding them we can opt out. I do not wish I were different. Living a life under a massive delusion is a tragic waste. |
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Hall of Famer |
Not everyone who is religious chooses that path because of a pack animal mentality or because they are delusional.
Growing up in a church that was abundant in hypocrisy but void of any intellectual value drove me away from religion. I'm naturally skeptical of everything and I've always had questions to ask. I couldn't simply shelve that when I doubted the existence of God. For me personally, a lack of belief didn't answer all of my questions that my church avoided, it simply created new ones. I still don't have all the answers, I probably never will. However, I've come to believe that there is something greater than ourselves out there, something beyond our comprehension and understanding. I'm simply skeptical of the concept that this existence is all there is and nothing more. I live my life to the fullest since we're not guaranteed a second on this earth, but I also believe it is possible there may be another existence after this one.  “Faith does not feed on thin air but on facts. Its instinct is to root itself in truth, to earth itself in reality, and this distinguishes faith from fantasy, the object of faith from the figment of the imagination.”—Os Guinness |
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Small Talker |
Of course it's possible, Nash. Mere possibility is a poor basis for faith, tho.
It's possible pigs will fly over your house today dropping gold coins all over your yard. I would not council faith that it will happen. So, based on some vague possibility, you go to a specific church, one that teaches a specific doctrine, one that accepts specific Truths to the exclusion of all others? You're welcome to it, it makes no sense to me. |
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Hall of Famer |
No, it's not possible for pigs to fly over my house.
I think you're trying to use Russel's Teapot analogy. The problem with it is that a celestial teapot is insignificant, it offers nothing and poses no change to our existence. Whether a china teapot is orbiting the sun or not makes no difference to our lives. Whether or not a higher power exists does. “Faith does not feed on thin air but on facts. Its instinct is to root itself in truth, to earth itself in reality, and this distinguishes faith from fantasy, the object of faith from the figment of the imagination.”—Os Guinness |
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Small Talker |
Aren't you just joining another group when you claim to be an atheist? Whether it's a religious or non_religious group it has a pack mentality, too. |
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Small Talker |
They are still equally unlikely. The teapot serves to demonstrate that an inability to disprove something is not evidence for its existence. Besides, I disagree. If they found a teapot orbiting the sun, just inside the orbit of Jupiter, it would be of very profound consequence. |
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Hall of Famer |
So if we discovered a teapot orbiting the sun, how would that change your life? “Faith does not feed on thin air but on facts. Its instinct is to root itself in truth, to earth itself in reality, and this distinguishes faith from fantasy, the object of faith from the figment of the imagination.”—Os Guinness |
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Everybody Knows My Name |
Thank you, Max. I know you’re trying to reassure me but how can you know for sure?
Nash, I’m also somewhat skeptical of the concept that this existence is all there is too, but I would like to know for sure. I wish I could also live my life to the fullest but it’s hard to do that when you have so many unanswered questions. |
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Small Talker |
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Small Talker |
It would be evidence that we are not alone. We certainly would not have put it there.
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Familiar Face |
I am traveling today, and will not be able to devote time to a sufficient answer. However, once back home, I will try to go through a bit of logic with you that has brought me a great deal of understanding and peace. Max "Truth is a target that moves in uncertain pathways." Get some help, Bill. Seriously. |
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Hall of Famer |
That doesn't answer the question. How would an orbiting tea pot directly change your life? “Faith does not feed on thin air but on facts. Its instinct is to root itself in truth, to earth itself in reality, and this distinguishes faith from fantasy, the object of faith from the figment of the imagination.”—Os Guinness |
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